buildworld question -- wrong version upgrade

Hello everyone,
I decided to try and become a real BSD user and buildworld on a test box. The OS running on it was FreeBSD 4.4-RELEASE and I was trying to upgrade it to the stable version of 4.5. I installed CVS as follows:

pkg_add -f ftp://ftp.FreeBSD.org/pub/FreeBSD/d...Sup/cvsupit.tgz

After installing, I was presented with a menu and I selected the stable version and all src + ports + docs to be safe. My cvsupfile that was created by the above command looks like this:


I then ran cvsup and downloaded all the files. After that I edited my /etc/make.conf file and it looks like this:


I dropped into single user mode and did
make -j4 buildworld
make buildkernel
make installkernel
make installworld

However, upon restarting the box, the uname -r now says 4.6-PRERELEASE. What gives here? I thought the tag in my cvsupfile (RELENG_4) should pull the stable version. Is it because of the second tag= in the cvsupfile that's causing this problem?

Also, a secondary question would be -- how should I get it back to the stable release?

Thanks in advance.

You really should have read in the FreeBSD maillist or www.freebsd.org .. Take the look at http://www.freebsd.org/news/newsflash.html#2002May1:0 , the FreeBSD-STABLE branch has been frozen.. Wait for a month to get STABLE branch again..

>> how should I get it back to the stable release?

I never have done it before, but did you make the backup? If not, then sorry, I have no idea.

Well, this 4.6-prerelease seems to work for me with no problems for now, but I REALLY wanted to upgrade from 4.4-RELEASE to 4.5-RELEASE. I thought that the tag=RELENG_4 line was what told it to update to a stable release.

I did back up all my code, so it should be trivial for me to reinstall 4.4 and then put back my code. However, I was wondering if it was possible to maybe clean out the contents of /usr/obj and the cvs log files, fix my cvsupfile (assuming that my problem is there) and redownload the sources for 4.5 and install it. I do have a 4.5-RELEASE CD and it would be easy enough for me to install from it, but I really would like to learn how to do an update via a buildworld. This way, I can also learn what I did wrong Can someone please tell me if there's a problem with my cvsupfile or something wrong with my procedure?

Thanks in advance.

I hope I understood your query.

For simplicity, you might be better of trying to upgrade from a release->release.

Since 4.6 is just around the corner, you might consider installing 4.5 from scratch from your CD. Assuming you have read the handbook sections 19.3 and 19.4, you should be just fine. Personally, 19.4 is a tad confusing, since the instructions seem a little out of place (going back-and-forth).

Is this what you were asking ? no ?

No matter what freebsd tries to tell you, it doesn't take running -stable to be a real user.

In fact, you should not run -stable in a production environment. That's what the new security branch is for (it's just -release with all security patches included).

For those that don't know, and for freebsd's benefit, here's the breakdown of CVS branches:

• -CURRENT: This is the bleeding edge development branch, known as 5.0-current. This will become the next major release of FreeBSD. Only developers and the curious should run this as it's in a constant state of flux.
• -STABLE: This is the development branch for the version of FreeBSD in general use. Right now, it's 4-STABLE (CVS tag RELENG_4). This is where improvements for the current release of FreeBSD are made, and where new development from -CURRENT get added. This shouldn't be used in production unless you really know what you are doing, and you follow the stable@ and hackers@ mailing lists. This branch will eventually lead to a -RELEASE.
• -RELEASE: A snapshot of the -STABLE branch, considered stable enough for production, every-day use. No further development occurs on this branch. (CVS tag RELENG_4_5_RELEASE at the moment, soon to be RELENG_4_6_RELEASE). This is the branch that most people should be using.
• The new security branch (doesn't have a fancy branch name). CVS tag is RELENG_4_5. This branch is -RELEASE+security fixes and other major patches. This is also the branch that production servers should be running.

Thus, -CURRENT is for developers and those who are curious about the future of FreeBSD. -STABLE is also for developers and for those who need specific pieces of software only available in -STABLE. -RELEASE is for everybody. The new security branch is the one that most people (especially those with production servers/desktops) should track via CVSUP.

So, if you want to be a "real" FreeBSD user: use FreeBSD everyday. That's all it takes. If anyone tries to tell you otherwise, they aren't firing on all cylinders.

>> No matter what freebsd tries to tell you, it doesn't take running -stable to be a real user

What I really meant is that, to become a real FreeBSD users you must learn how to cvsup + buildworld + recompile a kernel since those are essential steps you will have to go thru next week, if not tomorrow.
I made that strong statement in purpose to benefit the newbies to take the right learning approach. Not to mention running -STABLE gives you all the security patches plus new userland upgrades. Say openssh, you might want more than just bugfixes, perhaps the latest version + bugfixes.

>> That's what the new security branch is for

If you call that new, just so you know, that cvs tag is equivalent to OpenBSD's stable branch and it's been the same for dozen years. You think FreeBSD is playing catch-up here?

>> -RELEASE is for everybody

Maybe just for you and you can continue to run your whatever 4.x-RELEASE for the next 10 years. Please stop misleading users here. Better yet, you may track the security branch to practice yourself how to become a real user.

>> this 4.6-prerelease seems to work for me with no problems for now

Then why can't you keep it? You can cvsup again when 4.6-STABLE is available.

>> I thought that the tag=RELENG_4 line was what told it to update to a stable release

Read mezz reply.

>> fix my cvsupfile (assuming that my problem is there)

No. But you still should remove all the lines after src-all and never combine the supfile for your ports and src into one supfile.

>> I can also learn what I did wrong

You didn't so keep running it and cvsup again next month. The only mistakes might just be the bad timing on cvsup.

And you still don't need to run -STABLE to do this. In fact, you don't even need to know how to use the buildworld cycle. Yes, you should know how to use cvsup and how to compile your own kernel. Anything beyond that is not needed to be a real user.



Then you install it from ports. The only time you need to run -STABLE is if there is specific support in there that's not in -RELEASE and you absolutely need that support for your server/desktop to work. Otherwise, the only reason to run -STABLE is if you are curious.

Quote:

>> That's what the new security branch is for If you call that new, just so you know, that cvs tag is equivalent to OpenBSD's stable branch and it's been the same for dozen years. You think FreeBSD is playing catch-up here?

Considering this branch has only been around since the release of 4.4, I'd say, "Yes, it is new." And, since you don't consider it new, I'd have to say, "You haven't the foggiest idea what you are talking about."

Quote:

>> -RELEASE is for everybody Maybe just for you and you can continue to run your whatever 4.x-RELEASE for the next 10 years. Please stop misleading users here. Better yet, you may track the security branch to practice yourself how to become a real user.

I don't have to "practise" what I already am. As to running -RELEASE, that's exactly what I plan to do. Afterall, I have a business to run, and a school district to keep functional. No sense running development code, or a branch that jumps between useable and broken on an almost weekly basis. I would have to say, this is the second bit of almost good advice I've seen you post on here in the past month or two.

>> And you still don't need to run -STABLE to do this

What? Are you sure you have tried all that before?

1) Recompile a kernel:
I agreed with you. In fact, this's what I've been saying all the time: "recompile a custom kernel with your -RELEASE code, test it dozen times and make sure it works alright prior to cvsup'ing for -STABLE."

2) cvsup:
You can cvsup your src, your ports tree anytime, nobody can really stop you. What matters is the error when make install a port (i.e. mk error).

3) buildworld:
You still need the -STABLE src. Why in the world would you build a -RELEASE src which had been built previously and everyone running the same -RELEASE has the same userland and system binaries?

>> Considering this branch has only been around since the release of 4.4, I'd say, "Yes, it is new

This tells me you have no experience with other BSDs (i.e. Net and Open) when you didn't even aware that's the identical tag for OpenBSD. Tell you what, I have been running all 3 for many years and I bet not many people on earth can tell the real difference between the three.

I don't doubt your FreeBSD knowledge and I am more than willing to share experience with you to make us better individually. Just so you know, FreeBSD isn't perfect, in most cases I like it so much but I also hate in many situations when NetBSD can do things better than Free does.

>> or a branch that jumps between useable and broken on an almost weekly basis

Just so you know, the REAL development code is OpenBSD's current and is broken all over the places.

Yes. As mentioned before, we have boxes running 4.0, 4.1, 4.2, 4.3, 4.4, and 4.5 (the latter two running RELENG_4_4 and RELENG_4_5). No problems whatsoever with regards to ports. (Once 4.6 is released, these will all be upgraded to that.)



Now there's something I agree with.



And you still haven't shown what these "errors" are. I've done this without problems for a couple years now (since the release of 4.0). The only time you will run into problems is when your kernel and your userland are out-of-sync.



You don't need the -STABLE source. You can use a buildworld to update from one -RELEASE to another. Or to upgrade a 4.4-RELEASE to RELENG_4_4 or a 4.5-RELEASE to RELENG_4_5. The only time you should be running -STABLE is if you need the software/hardware support and can't wait for the next -RELEASE, or if you are a developer looking to work on FreeBSD, or if you are curious.



We're not talking about other BSDs. We're talking about FreeBSD. This whole thread is about FreeBSD. This tag is new to FreeBSD. Doesn't matter what the other BSDs are doing, it has no bearing on this discussion.



No, development for FreeBSD does not happen in the OpenBSD source tree. It happens in the FreeBSD source tree. Some happens in the -CURRENT tree, some happens in the -STABLE tree.

A lot of the time, the -CURRENT tree is broken due to heavy development. Sometimes, the -STABLE tree is broken due to heavy development. Rarely is the -RELEASE broken as no development goes on there. Which one sounds better for production or home computers?

Thanks for your help everyone. I was actually working off the FreeBSD handbook and I wasn't quite sure if I did everything correctly, cuz it's my first buildworld. It's a relief to know that I didn't screw up. Now for the next part -- recompiling the kernel --- luckily this is one step that I've done several times (and learned from all my mistakes)

>> you still haven't shown what these "errors" are

Something about bsd.port.mk mismatch or something. In fact, I have never faced such problem because I've always been doing things correctly.

>> since the release of 4.0

Like I said many times, when are you going to stop lying? A -RELEASE branch prior to 4.3 needs to install 4xupgrade in order to use the current ports, because the current (latest) ports tree is made for -STABLE and -CURRENT users.
Even with the 4xupgrade hack, I have seen numerous complaints that it was broken for some ports, thus that's why I said people running -RELEASE branch shouldn't cvsup to the current ports for maximum reliability, not that it wouldn't work at all.

>> The only time you should be running -STABLE is if you need the software/hardware support and can't wait for the next -RELEASE

Wrong. A -RELEASE branch might be stable but not secure for sure. The -STABLE branch is to fix any stability problems found in -RELEASE plus all the latest bugfixes.

>> Rarely is the -RELEASE broken as no development goes on there

All -RELEASE branches were broken in some ways, but not necessary significant enough for users to notice such minimal changes. Those get fixed or improved in -STABLE.