Business Help
 
Forums: » Register « |  User CP |  Games |  Calendar |  Members |  FAQs |  Sitemap |  Support | 
User Name:
Password:
Remember me
Go Back   Dev Shed ForumsWeb Site ManagementBusiness Help

Reply
Add This Thread To:
  Del.icio.us   Digg   Google   Spurl   Blink   Furl   Simpy   Y! MyWeb 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
 
Unread Dev Shed Forums Sponsor:
Learn five alternative approaches for automating the delivery of Excel-based reports. Read all about it in the free whitepaper: “Automating Excel Reports: Five Approaches for Java DevelopersDownload Now!
  #1  
Old January 29th, 2006, 11:47 PM
yoey2000 yoey2000 is offline
MMMM...Brains....
Dev Shed Newbie (0 - 499 posts)
 
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 459 yoey2000 User rank is Just a Lowly Private (1 - 20 Reputation Level) 
Time spent in forums: 2 Days 11 h 11 m 37 sec
Reputation Power: 7
Legal use of a PHP script

Quick question : if a script is released under the GNU license, and is available for free download, am i legally allowed to charge users to use the script on my website? I am not selling it, I am charging for its intended use on a website.

for example, I download a free ecard script which is released under the GNU license. Am i legally allowed to charge membership to send ecards on my site, using this script?

thanks.

Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old January 30th, 2006, 12:16 AM
jharnois's Avatar
jharnois jharnois is offline
mod_dev_shed
Dev Shed God 19th Plane (14000 - 14499 posts)
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 14,149 jharnois User rank is Brigadier General (60000 - 70000 Reputation Level)jharnois User rank is Brigadier General (60000 - 70000 Reputation Level)jharnois User rank is Brigadier General (60000 - 70000 Reputation Level)jharnois User rank is Brigadier General (60000 - 70000 Reputation Level)jharnois User rank is Brigadier General (60000 - 70000 Reputation Level)jharnois User rank is Brigadier General (60000 - 70000 Reputation Level)jharnois User rank is Brigadier General (60000 - 70000 Reputation Level)jharnois User rank is Brigadier General (60000 - 70000 Reputation Level)jharnois User rank is Brigadier General (60000 - 70000 Reputation Level)jharnois User rank is Brigadier General (60000 - 70000 Reputation Level)jharnois User rank is Brigadier General (60000 - 70000 Reputation Level)jharnois User rank is Brigadier General (60000 - 70000 Reputation Level)jharnois User rank is Brigadier General (60000 - 70000 Reputation Level) 
Time spent in forums: 1 Month 1 Week 1 Day 13 h 12 m 17 sec
Reputation Power: 717
Have you read the GNU GPL?
__________________
# Jeremy

Explain your problem instead of asking how to do what you decided was the solution.

Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old January 30th, 2006, 12:21 AM
codergeek42's Avatar
codergeek42 codergeek42 is offline
Language Nerd
Dev Shed God 2nd Plane (6000 - 6499 posts)
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Anaheim, CA (USA)
Posts: 6,391 codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)  Folding Points: 35702 Folding Title: Starter FolderFolding Points: 35702 Folding Title: Starter Folder
Time spent in forums: 1 Month 1 Week 5 Days 18 h 20 m 28 sec
Reputation Power: 923
Send a message via ICQ to codergeek42 Send a message via AIM to codergeek42 Send a message via Yahoo to codergeek42 Send a message via Google Talk to codergeek42
(Moved from PHP Development to Business Help, where such legal/licensing issues should be discussed.)

My understanding is that you can charge for things like membership services and support; but you cannot charge anything for the actual permission to use the software. Though, that may not exactly be easily differentiated on such a site.
__________________
~~ Peter ~~
( My Blog: ...The thoughts and ravings of a lost and wandering mind... ) :: ( Supporter of the EFF & FSF ) :: ( I'm a GNU/Linux addict and Free Software Advocate. ) :: ( How to Ask Questions the Smart Way ) :: ( The Fedora Project, sponsored by Red Hat ) :: ( GNOME: The Free Software Desktop Project ) :: ( GnuPG Public Key )

Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old January 30th, 2006, 12:29 AM
Conundrum's Avatar
Conundrum Conundrum is offline
Contributing User
Dev Shed Beginner (1000 - 1499 posts)
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,108 Conundrum User rank is First Lieutenant (10000 - 20000 Reputation Level)Conundrum User rank is First Lieutenant (10000 - 20000 Reputation Level)Conundrum User rank is First Lieutenant (10000 - 20000 Reputation Level)Conundrum User rank is First Lieutenant (10000 - 20000 Reputation Level)Conundrum User rank is First Lieutenant (10000 - 20000 Reputation Level)Conundrum User rank is First Lieutenant (10000 - 20000 Reputation Level)Conundrum User rank is First Lieutenant (10000 - 20000 Reputation Level)Conundrum User rank is First Lieutenant (10000 - 20000 Reputation Level) 
Time spent in forums: 1 Week 3 Days 12 h 46 m 55 sec
Reputation Power: 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by yoey2000
for example, I download a free ecard script which is released under the GNU license. Am i legally allowed to charge membership to send ecards on my site, using this script?
I'm not an expert but my understanding is that you cannot sell the script or modified versions of the script but you can charge for a service that utilizes the script. If your site is sending out ecards, part of the service would be the transmission of the ecard using your mail server, something that is not included in the ecard script. For example, E*Trade runs on Red Hat Linux which is GPL and E*Trade charges a commission to let people execute stock transactions. I would assume that Linux's GPL doesn't prevent E*Trade from charging commissions for services that utilize Linux GPL code. I'm in no way an expert but that makes sense to me.
__________________
Dev411 | Grokbase | Compare CPAN Modules

Last edited by Conundrum : January 30th, 2006 at 12:35 AM.

Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old January 30th, 2006, 12:36 AM
kuza55's Avatar
kuza55 kuza55 is offline
It's only wrong if you're caught....
Dev Shed Beginner (1000 - 1499 posts)
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 1,286 kuza55 User rank is Second Lieutenant (5000 - 10000 Reputation Level)kuza55 User rank is Second Lieutenant (5000 - 10000 Reputation Level)kuza55 User rank is Second Lieutenant (5000 - 10000 Reputation Level)kuza55 User rank is Second Lieutenant (5000 - 10000 Reputation Level)kuza55 User rank is Second Lieutenant (5000 - 10000 Reputation Level)kuza55 User rank is Second Lieutenant (5000 - 10000 Reputation Level)kuza55 User rank is Second Lieutenant (5000 - 10000 Reputation Level) 
Time spent in forums: 3 Weeks 3 Days 6 h 7 m 44 sec
Reputation Power: 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by codergeek42
(Moved from PHP Development to Business Help, where such legal/licensing issues should be discussed.)

My understanding is that you can charge for things like membership services and support; but you cannot charge anything for the actual permission to use the software. Though, that may not exactly be easily differentiated on such a site.
I think if you want to sell the script to others, then well, thats just unethical IMO, and under the GPL you aren't allowed to do that. You also have to license it under the GPL when distributing it. You could as codergeek said charge for support of the software, or something similar, but you cannot under any circumstances charge for the actual code.

Now, if you want to use it on your site, and charge for its use, then I think you would be able to say that you're charging for the running costs of the script, and the images you use in the ecards, etc, etc.....

But IANAL, so take what I've said with a pinch of salt, and read the like jeremy posted....

[EDIT]: Ugh, yeah, what Conundrum said......
__________________
- Alex
Web Security Research (my blog)
Handbook of Applied Cryptography (Free!)

Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old January 30th, 2006, 12:42 AM
codergeek42's Avatar
codergeek42 codergeek42 is offline
Language Nerd
Dev Shed God 2nd Plane (6000 - 6499 posts)
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Anaheim, CA (USA)
Posts: 6,391 codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)  Folding Points: 35702 Folding Title: Starter FolderFolding Points: 35702 Folding Title: Starter Folder
Time spent in forums: 1 Month 1 Week 5 Days 18 h 20 m 28 sec
Reputation Power: 923
Send a message via ICQ to codergeek42 Send a message via AIM to codergeek42 Send a message via Yahoo to codergeek42 Send a message via Google Talk to codergeek42
Quote:
Originally Posted by kuza55
[...] but you cannot under any circumstances charge for the actual code.


Slight correction to this: You may charge for the physical costs of the source code's reproduction (bandwidth costs, or costs of creating a CD of the code and mailing that to the user, etc.); but you cannot charge for the actual licensing itself. It's a little odd at first. In fact, you may legally charge any arbitrary amount you choose for this, with the sole restriction that the cost of the reproduction of the source code may not exceed that of the reproduction cost of the distributed binaries.

Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old January 30th, 2006, 12:48 AM
kuza55's Avatar
kuza55 kuza55 is offline
It's only wrong if you're caught....
Dev Shed Beginner (1000 - 1499 posts)
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 1,286 kuza55 User rank is Second Lieutenant (5000 - 10000 Reputation Level)kuza55 User rank is Second Lieutenant (5000 - 10000 Reputation Level)kuza55 User rank is Second Lieutenant (5000 - 10000 Reputation Level)kuza55 User rank is Second Lieutenant (5000 - 10000 Reputation Level)kuza55 User rank is Second Lieutenant (5000 - 10000 Reputation Level)kuza55 User rank is Second Lieutenant (5000 - 10000 Reputation Level)kuza55 User rank is Second Lieutenant (5000 - 10000 Reputation Level) 
Time spent in forums: 3 Weeks 3 Days 6 h 7 m 44 sec
Reputation Power: 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by codergeek42
Slight correction to this: You may charge for the physical costs of the source code's reproduction (bandwidth costs, or costs of creating a CD of the code and mailing that to the user, etc.); but you cannot charge for the actual licensing itself. It's a little odd at first. In fact, you may legally charge any arbitrary amount you choose for this, with the sole restriction that the cost of the reproduction of the source code may not exceed that of the reproduction cost of the distributed binaries.


Ok, what i meant was you can't charge for the Inetelectual Property of the code itself....reproduction and distribution costs aren't covered under that (so you can buy linux CDs for example, and they can charge you for the cost of burning the CD, the CD itself, and any delivery costs, etc), I forgot to mention that....About restrictions on charging for distribution I have no idea about, so when you say
Quote:
Originally Posted by codergeek42
with the sole restriction that the cost of the reproduction of the source code may not exceed that of the reproduction cost of the distributed binaries.
What is 'the reproduction cost of the distributed binaries'?

Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old January 30th, 2006, 09:52 AM
yoey2000 yoey2000 is offline
MMMM...Brains....
Dev Shed Newbie (0 - 499 posts)
 
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 459 yoey2000 User rank is Just a Lowly Private (1 - 20 Reputation Level) 
Time spent in forums: 2 Days 11 h 11 m 37 sec
Reputation Power: 7
"Have you read the GNU GPL?"

Yes I have, but I still want to be sure just incase I misread. Better safe than sorry.

Yes, I am not selling the script. I am just selling a membership to use this script on my website.

But im still confused on whether its allowed for profit.

Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old January 30th, 2006, 10:02 AM
codergeek42's Avatar
codergeek42 codergeek42 is offline
Language Nerd
Dev Shed God 2nd Plane (6000 - 6499 posts)
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Anaheim, CA (USA)
Posts: 6,391 codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)codergeek42 User rank is General (90000 - 100000 Reputation Level)  Folding Points: 35702 Folding Title: Starter FolderFolding Points: 35702 Folding Title: Starter Folder
Time spent in forums: 1 Month 1 Week 5 Days 18 h 20 m 28 sec
Reputation Power: 923
Send a message via ICQ to codergeek42 Send a message via AIM to codergeek42 Send a message via Yahoo to codergeek42 Send a message via Google Talk to codergeek42
Quote:
Originally Posted by kuza55
About restrictions on charging for distribution I have no idea about, so when you say [...] What is 'the reproduction cost of the distributed binaries'?
Basically, you can charge any arbitrary amount for the physical transfer of the software and its source code (costs which may include things ike bandwidth, or the cost of creating CDs with all the source code and binaries on them, for example). For example, you could legally charge charge $10,000 for such a binary CD; but if you did that you could only legally charge a maximum of $10,000 for the cost of the CD containing the sources. Hope that helps.

Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old January 30th, 2006, 10:05 AM
Conundrum's Avatar
Conundrum Conundrum is offline
Contributing User
Dev Shed Beginner (1000 - 1499 posts)
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,108 Conundrum User rank is First Lieutenant (10000 - 20000 Reputation Level)Conundrum User rank is First Lieutenant (10000 - 20000 Reputation Level)Conundrum User rank is First Lieutenant (10000 - 20000 Reputation Level)Conundrum User rank is First Lieutenant (10000 - 20000 Reputation Level)Conundrum User rank is First Lieutenant (10000 - 20000 Reputation Level)Conundrum User rank is First Lieutenant (10000 - 20000 Reputation Level)Conundrum User rank is First Lieutenant (10000 - 20000 Reputation Level)Conundrum User rank is First Lieutenant (10000 - 20000 Reputation Level) 
Time spent in forums: 1 Week 3 Days 12 h 46 m 55 sec
Reputation Power: 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by yoey2000
Yes, I am not selling the script. I am just selling a membership to use this script on my website.
This sounds very strange to me. In most cases people sell memberships to services they create that use a script, not selling membership to use a GPL script directly. What do you mean by that?
Quote:
Originally Posted by yoey2000
But im still confused on whether its allowed for profit.
If you're very concerned about this you can:
  • Contact the copyright owner of the PHP script

Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old January 30th, 2006, 10:56 AM
xlordt's Avatar
xlordt xlordt is offline
Only the strong survives!!.
Dev Shed God 1st Plane (5500 - 5999 posts)
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: A World of wonder.
Posts: 5,516 xlordt User rank is Major (30000 - 40000 Reputation Level)xlordt User rank is Major (30000 - 40000 Reputation Level)xlordt User rank is Major (30000 - 40000 Reputation Level)xlordt User rank is Major (30000 - 40000 Reputation Level)xlordt User rank is Major (30000 - 40000 Reputation Level)xlordt User rank is Major (30000 - 40000 Reputation Level)xlordt User rank is Major (30000 - 40000 Reputation Level)xlordt User rank is Major (30000 - 40000 Reputation Level)xlordt User rank is Major (30000 - 40000 Reputation Level)xlordt User rank is Major (30000 - 40000 Reputation Level)  Folding Points: 103903 Folding Title: Super Ultimate Folder - Level 1Folding Points: 103903 Folding Title: Super Ultimate Folder - Level 1Folding Points: 103903 Folding Title: Super Ultimate Folder - Level 1Folding Points: 103903 Folding Title: Super Ultimate Folder - Level 1Folding Points: 103903 Folding Title: Super Ultimate Folder - Level 1Folding Points: 103903 Folding Title: Super Ultimate Folder - Level 1
Time spent in forums: 4 Weeks 1 Day 14 h 51 m 14 sec
Reputation Power: 378
Send a message via ICQ to xlordt Send a message via AIM to xlordt Send a message via MSN to xlordt Send a message via Yahoo to xlordt Send a message via Google Talk to xlordt Send a message via Skype to xlordt
Facebook
what if you were the creater of the program, and you wanted to charge.. is there a particular license for this? or can you create it your self? anyone has any example?

p.s: Decided to post it here.. since the thread speaces about it (sorta ).

Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old January 30th, 2006, 11:41 AM
codergeek42's Avatar
codergeek42 codergeek42 is offline
Language Nerd
Dev Shed God 2nd Plane (6000 - 6499 posts)
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Anaheim, CA (USA)
Posts: 6,391