Need some life advice from you all.

Please bare with me, this is a long post.

Okay, its the holidays and i am in the dumps.

Im currently in my 3rd year in college and i have nothing to show for it. I just switched my major from computer engineering to information studies (IT stuff). I know that my decision to switch was the right one b/c i was not happy in engineering. i was sleeping very very little and not getting anything out of it. i was not happy with what i was persuing. i didnt see myself doing what i was learning for the rest of my life. IT on the other hand is what i find fun, so i decided to try it. So far i enjoy it very much.

The reason why i am asking for help is b/c i have gotten some of my grades back from last semester. I gave it my all. I mean my all. I sacrificed so much to do better. I though i did. For once, i actually remember what i did in class. I enjoyed going to class and doing the work. But now that i get my grades back i am less than satisfied. People say you get back what you put in. Well, i put in my all and i got less than what i put in. I passed my classes, but not with grades i would go bragging about.

I am now 20 years old and i have nothing to show for my last 3 years of education. Yes i have made many life long friends and learned many life lessons, but i have nothing to show for what i learned in school. I am now worried that when i graduate, i will have little to show for my employer when i do start looking for a job.

I do want to persue a carrer in the IT field (networking, administration, etc, etc). It has been my life long hobby. But when i look at it from a distance, i dont really know that much for a kid that is obsessed with his hobby. Yes i know linux, windows and all the stuff a 15 year old obsessed with computers would know. But there is nothing that seperates me from the norm.

All my life i see myself being average. I dont want to be average. I want to be known as the kid that did this or did that.

My question is, have you been in my shoes? How did you cope with it. Right now i am clueless about my life.

Death seems like a possible escape from what i am going through. I dont think about killing myself, but at the same time it seems life would be easier if it all ended.

C'mon man, you need to get your **** together. You're not in the top of your class, so what?

My education is in networking and math - but there is no way in hell I can do either one of those professionally (well may be teaching math in high school). At some point I dug into web stuff, and now that's what I do for living. But if you asked me during my college time about web, I'd be like "pfffft! thats wack!". Half of people I knew in uni now work as sales managers in respectable companies - all because neither one of us did well in our field. So we all ended up doing pretty much what we wanted (IT-stuff) without killing ourselves while studying.

It's probably too late for you to change your major, but what you could do is learn something from adjacent areas of IT craft. Don't be so harsh on yourself - hard it skills is not all that counts. If you have great personality and like work with people go for sales - they make some big bucks and only general IT knowledge required. I reckon that's what I will do when get tired of developing apps.

Well i am now studying IT. Im not that behind but i will push myself to do more and get more involved with beyond just a classroom enviroment.

>>Im not that behind but i will push myself to do more and get more involved
>>with beyond just a classroom enviroment.
You've tried that. Didn't work. My point is that you cannot kill yourself over some worthless piece of information which, odds are, you will never use in your entire life. Good way of involvment is to get some work experience - even if it pays close to nothing or doesn't pay at all. AFAIK, employers are more keen to hire people with hands on training then book smart geeks.

I actually got degrees in both Engineering and CS, so I know it can kick your *** at times and seem unsatisfying. But, if you genuinely weren't having fun learning the stuff (university taught me that you can have fun while getting your *** kicked when it comes to learning), then your decision to switch was absolutely right. And grades really don't matter that much outside of the academic arena. It may help you get a better entry-level job (some entry-level jobs may impose a minimum GPA requirement), but once you've got 2-3 years experience under your belt it doesn't matter what grades you made.

What's most important is that you genuinely thirst for knowledge of what you are doing. I'd say that 90-95% of the programming stuff I learned was stuff that I learned on my own by playing around with programming languages and whatnot that were way outside of the scopes of my classes (with two majors at once I didn't have time in my schedule to take any specialty courses, so I had to do my own digging). So while I didn't have a 3.9 GPA to throw on my resume, I had a long list of language, OS, and other concept familiarities that I could put on instead. And, during interviews I've been able to discuss more interesting things because I am genuninely interested in what I do.

So, my advice is to find little side projects that involve your schooling somewhat, but take it in a new direction that your classes won't go. In your case, you might set up your own network and try to do some interesting things with it. Or work for your school's sysadmin, or do some volunteer maintenance at a local high school, or ... well, you see where I'm going with this.

But the bottom line is - you have to enjoy what you are doing, or you're making a mistake.

I don't come from an IT background, but I do have university experience and life experience, and I suspect that what you are asking has less to do with IT specifically and more along the lines of what we all face as people struggling along this lifepath trying to make sense of things, and hoping that something in what we do might make a difference. Did I read you correctly killerasp?

At the risk of sounding like my father ... I am nearly twice your age and some of the things that I have picked up along the way concern - and echo - the comments of both Strike and ALCapone: experience really is more important than grades ... especially where it counts!! While my PhD gets me into an interview, it is my concrete experience coupled with how I present myself that really wins me the job/contract or not. Grades are great for universities ... but universities are theoretical learning environments. If I were to hire someone, I would be more inclined to go for the person with experience but no uni degree than the person with a uni degree but no experience. Experience is something that uni just can't teach. I'd look at your willingness to learn (you did digging on your own time, exploring things that interested you - that's great because it shows initiative and the ability to manage your own learning process). At the risk of sounding corny or cliched - the real learning only happens at post-grad level whether that is formal post-grad (masters, etc.) or informal post-grad (i.e. working). Also, by doing something that you enjoy - IT - you will find that you have energy for it, enthusiasm, etc and this will be apparent to those who interview you.
Finally, just because your knowledge is not reflected in your grades, the true test of knowledge is what you can do with it. For e.g. you are probably able to do far more than you even know that you can do, and that if you were to be sat in front of a console you'd do just great doing what you can do because it comes naturally to you. You dismiss that you know Linux and Windows, etc. - don't take that lightly. I'd love to know what you know.
Finally, it is never, ever, ever grades that separate one from the norm: the people I most admire are not because of how well they did in school. It is because of the calibre of their personhood - and there are no uni courses on that!! - it is because of the way they live their lives, the way that they touch the lives of others, the contributions they make to the global community (or at the very least, the smaller the footprint that they leave on the planet in terms of negativity), whether they are able to assume responsibility for their choices/actions, and whether they are able to maintain that difficult balance between claiming their rights and upholding their responsibilities as global citizens. FWIW, these are the qualities that separate some persons from the norm ... their GPA doesn't even enter into it in anyway, shape or form!!

As for death being an escape ... well, of course it is. But, let's face it - if you did off yourself then (a) you'd never get a chance to pull yourself above the norm and (b) mediocrity would have claimed another victim by blinding to the fact that the only constant is change and that where you are right now will change also. If you were to die (and you will one day, so don't be in too much of a hurry to get there 'cos there is no coming back from that one), then you would miss out on the chance to experience those changes ... and it is the sum of those changes and how we, in turn, respond to them and attempt to influence them that make us who we are: average or exceptional.
So, killerasp, the ball is back in your court: how do you want to play this challenge? The most difficult and testing battles are always within: we are always our very worst and most challenging opponents
Good luck in your challenge ... please let us know how you get on.
Cheers
AmF

We get at least 3 or 4 of these posts a year here at Devshed.

Heh, even when I was 25, my education was still a mess. And at that point I had no idea I was going to end up in web programming (I studied a bit of everything, but ended up with an English education degree). I became deeply depressed for awhile. I thought the 'good career train' had already passed me by.

But one thing I did do was to just keep on reading as many different books as I could, trying to learn what choices there are in life. I'm talking about serious literature, philosophy, science, etc... (as well as a liberal helping of science fiction and adventure stories ). It was actually a relief after college not to end up stuck in some slot somewhere. it gave me some freedom to think. I went through several unglamorous lower-paying jobs, but one thing I learned: if you approach life right, then no experience is useless. It's all useful in some way or another. Even when I worked at manual labor jobs, I tried to respect the work and learn from it.

You are young. Don't let anyone tell you that it's all over if you don't decide right now what you are going to be. In fact, what is all this talk of what someone is going to "be"? What a concept. You are a person, not a thing. You can't "be" anything but yourself. What you choose to do with your time is another thing.

Remember this: people are living longer lives, and retiring later, and there is more education available than there ever was before. You can even audit MIT courses online these days. Do you think its going to stop? No, you can keep learning as long as you live, so don't think it ends with a degree at some college. I agree wholeheartedly with ahimsa; you haven't even started learning yet. Take things one step at a time.

I went through this same feeling a couple of months ago. If you search, you'll find a post from a while back where I asked for some advice on my college career as well.

Since then, I've learned that education is a basis for learning. Sounds wierd, but it's true. While you're in school, they're going to throw all sorts of bizarre thoughts and theories out at you, and some of them will be helpful, others are just "nice to know" types of information. For this reason, don't think that your ability in the field lives and dies based on what you do in school. What's far more important has already been broached by others here: interest, willingness to learn and keep working, blah blah. If you really like what you're doing now, don't worry if you get bogged down in some of the theory now and then.

I started my post-HS education in a CIS field. I always thought that programming, especially on the web, looked really neat, but I was always afraid to give it a try. Then, my school offered a web developer degree. I took a deep breath, jumped into it, and got a C in my first course. This was actually a crushing experience for me, and I almost went back into CIS even though I hated it. But then I started working on some programming on my own, just messing around and toying with it, and I found that, when left to do it on my own terms, I was able learn it fairly quickly (with plenty of help from the folks here - thanks especially to Hero Zzyzzx and MrRichardFeder for his help early on). I just needed to figure out how I needed to learn.

Don't throw away all the work you've done to this point just because of this. If you have the interest, it will come to you in time. Maybe slowly, maybe all at once one day, but eventually you'll get it and things will just start clicking into place. You're twenty and you've gotten into something you really enjoy. If you want to, you can take the next 10 years to study it in depth.

Oh, and speaking strictly on the grades thing... plbbbt. When I was your age I had a 2.0 GPA. Don't worry about the grades. I agree whole-heartedly with those other members that said that grades will get you a prettier entry-level job, but it's sheer interest, determination, and willingness to learn that's going to get you far in the long run.

Wrap up on my humble thoughts on your situation: don't worry about your grades. Try to pull them up, especially if it makes you feel better, but don't think that your future hinges on them. If you have the determination and love for it, you WILL excel in whatever field you choose to follow. Keep plugging away at what you love, and you'll be just fine.

Hey guys. THanks for your words of wisdom. I knew that there were people that were like me, but to actually get to know how they handled themseleves has helped me more than you can imagine.

I will go ahead continue with my IT degree and will try my best to finish on time with the rest of my class.

Hopefully i will try to get more real world experience through internships and hope that will give me insight on what i want to do with my life.

Thanks.

I've just got to say you guys are awesome. I couldn't ask for a better community, and I'm honored to have you guys all using this site.

By the way, I'm 32 years old, have 4 kids, and am still working on my Bachelor's degree. I wouldn't wish this on anyone (full time job, two businesses, wife, family, and 10-12 credits a semester), but I do believe it will all be worth it some day, even if I can just say, "I did it."

From the employer side, the degree says just one thing to me: This guy has the ability to stick with something, work hard, and complete it. The grades are just details. By the time you finish 4 years, half of what you learn will be obsolete anyway. You just learn how to learn.

Take care, have a great new year, and get away from it all once in a while. I've been where you are, getting away helps tons.


Randy Cosby
President
Developer Shed, Inc.

Hey killerasp

I had just finished my junior year at LSU in Petroleum Engineering when one day I realized I didn't want to do that for the rest of my life. A choice I had made as an 18-year-old turned out to be a bad one by the time I turned 22. So I switched to Chemical Engineering. Then Engineering Design. Then Computer Science. Then Mathematics. Then back to Computer Science. I needed 4 years and 132 hours of class to graduate. When I finally got my bachelor's degree 8.5 years later I had 213 hours of class and a 2.1 grade average. I had paid for it all myself and was working three jobs to make ends meet. It was not easy, took a very long time, I made a lot of mistakes and got very discouraged. I had plenty of opportunities and reasons to quit but I didn't and now I'm glad I stuck with it.

When I finally graduated, I didn't immediately land a great job. I started working for a trucking and warehousing company as a programmer. But when they needed me to, I had to run a forklift and load 18-wheelers. Not exactly a glamorous high-tech IT job. But just like college, I used this as an opportunity to learn new technologies and get some real-world experience. Eventually I got a better job and then another one. Now I love getting up and going to work each morning. It just took a while to get to this point.

Good luck. You're not alone.

If all else fails, there's always the Army, right??

Army of One! (one PHP programmer, it seems)

---John Holmes...

On a light note, im very fit but i am near sighted and have severe flat feet.