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    Exclamation I don't want monday to come :'(


    We get ****ed over again. Thanks Congress.

    Monay's FBI Wiretap
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    So they can even check your online banking activity ? Talk about big brother watching you huh.
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    The thing is who are they gonna catch with all this? Large criminal and terrorist organizations are going to use some sort of system to keep themselves from being exposed to the Big brother/FBI.

    On the flipside, us innocent civilians are having our personal information published in a neat convenient way for hackers and untrustworthy service provider employees to gain easy access to(and then of course sell it to criminal and terrorist organizations).

    Oh the irony.
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    People need to get over themselves. Do you all think your lives are so goddamn exciting that the government has nothing better to do than to watch your online activities? Man... get out those tinfoil hats everyone.

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    People need to get over themselves. Do you all think your lives are so goddamn exciting that the government has nothing better to do than to watch your online activities? Man... get out those tinfoil hats everyone.
    It took me 2 weeks to make this hat, and I am going to wear it.

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    Originally Posted by Adrastea0413
    People need to get over themselves. Do you all think your lives are so goddamn exciting that the government has nothing better to do than to watch your online activities? Man... get out those tinfoil hats everyone.

    it's not that the government has access to these things, it's that people have access to these things. Way to create a large repository of sensitive information in one place so one person can steal it all.
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    Originally Posted by Adrastea0413
    People need to get over themselves. Do you all think your lives are so goddamn exciting that the government has nothing better to do than to watch your online activities? Man... get out those tinfoil hats everyone.

    Yeah? Then install cameras in your house so people can see what you're doing. What's wrong with that? You're not important, nobody will care what you do. But you should do it anyways.

    Your argument is old and everyone's killed it, so I'm surprised you still use it. The point isn't that I, personally, will have my activities monitored - the point is that people can choose to do so at any random time for any random reason and do it. It's a power easily abused, and therefore will be abused.

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    • M.Hirsch agrees
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    Are they gonna be using this kinda stuff to catch software and music pirates, or just terrorist related stuff?
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    well no one really knows, they make it sound so great by saying they want to use it to stop terrorists (great punch line with the 9/11 attacks).

    I doubt its to catch software pirates, usually thats the RIAA teaming up with ISPs doing that, Plus with how most of pirated software exchange is coming to be, spying on a single or a few peoples connections and taking them down isn't worth the time and money. Because most people share their pirated music and software through bit torrent now a days where there is no single source of the files. (I'm not sure if im breaking any TOS discussing that am i?)

    I think what most people are concerned about (or at least what I am concerned about) is really sensitive information being published to a single source (ie online banking related things)
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    You won't be losing your privacy Monday. You been losing it piecemeal for a long time.
    sensitive information being published to a single source
    You're also dealing in non-facts, which is the way to win religious or political converts, or used-car customers, but not the way to fight over-reaching governments.

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    • Matt1776 agrees : Thats exactly correct.
    • M.Hirsch agrees
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    Originally Posted by gimp
    Yeah? Then install cameras in your house so people can see what you're doing. What's wrong with that? You're not important, nobody will care what you do. But you should do it anyways.
    Because requiring VoIP providers to accommodate wiretapping in the same manner that landlines are already equipped for is the same exact thing as putting a camera in your house.

    So CALEA was passed in 1994 for the current technologies of that time.... and now they want to keep up with changing technologies and everyone cries about it.
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    Originally Posted by sizablegrin
    You won't be losing your privacy Monday. You been losing it piecemeal for a long time.

    You're also dealing in non-facts, which is the way to win religious or political converts, or used-car customers, but not the way to fight over-reaching governments.
    it's not a single source, but information is being delivered to the government in a uniform fashion from multiple locations, someone is going to catch on and exploit this. There is no denying it.
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  25. I <3 ASCII
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    Originally Posted by Adrastea0413
    So CALEA was passed in 1994 for the current technologies of that time.... and now they want to keep up with changing technologies and everyone cries about it.
    I'd say there's a huge issue when it comes to privacy and changing technologies. Specifically cost and distribution.

    20 years ago the cost of copying a song for a friend was relatively expensive compared to what it is today, finding someone with the song you want, getting a tape, taking the time to record it etc. Today, that same issue is a lot cheaper in both time and resources, you can obtain perhaps a few hundred songs with the same amount of effort and resources as obtaining one song took 2 decades ago.

    Putting the shoe on the other foot, how is it different when it's your privacy at stake. 20 years ago a wiretap was a relatively expensive process, storage media, going through the data etc. Today it's effectively possible that *all* of your phone conversations could be recorded, sent through a voice analyzer, transcribed mined etc. with very little effort.

    Granted this is a good thing when time is of the essence in a terrorism investigation, but would you feel just as warm and fuzzy about it if the cops were 'just seeing what was going on' in your personal life?

    IMO crying about existing laws keeping in track with technological changes is going to be one of the defining points of what this decade will be about. These aren't simple decisions.

    -MBirchmeier
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    Originally Posted by MBirchmeier
    Granted this is a good thing when time is of the essence in a terrorism investigation, but would you feel just as warm and fuzzy about it if the cops were 'just seeing what was going on' in your personal life?
    If a cop opens my front door, walks into my house, and just looks around to see what was going on in my personal life does that mean that we should outlaw search warrants?
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    If a cop opens my front door, walks into my house, and just looks around to see what was going on in my personal life does that mean that we should outlaw search warrants?
    I don't think that analogy quite applies. If a cop were to enter your house to take a look, it's usually quite visible. Contrast that with silent monitoring like wiretapping capabilities. You don't know if you are being monitored, and even though statistically, you probably aren't, it still has a chilling effect. It's not whether you are being monitored or not, it's whether you think you are being monitored or not. Thus, there is a danger to first amendment and privacy in this situation.

    But wait, it's not like I missed the rest of your posts. I was thinking along the same lines of this simply being an update for modern technologies.

    I feel like I'm in danger of ignoring your post MBirchmeier. But I really did read it! And I don't understand. It's ok if phones are tapped, but not if VoIP is? What is the difference? Both are just as easily tapped, and as secretly monitored. Yet the outrage is all over the internet side of tapping? Why the bias?

    Err, don't brand me as taking a side here. I don't have one. I'm just trying to absorb all the points that may be raised in a debate over this.
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